PrizeWriter: Talk about your upbringing and growing up as a child --- your early involvement in art and how you think you came to filmmaking based on all of these things.
María Laura Ruggiero: Well, my mother's a teacher; she's a [kindergarten] teacher. My mom [read] us English fairy tales and the typical children's stories, but she changed them because she thought they were really cruel. So she decided to tell me Greek myths as fairy tales [ever] since I was a really young kid. I was completely fascinated with that—all the characters in Greek mythology. Those were my fairy tales when I was growing up. I think I found out who Cinderella was when I was fifteen or something.
I learned to read and write when I was really young because, well, my mom was a teacher. Since I can remember, I started writing stories, like small school plays. It was very natural for me to write. But at the same time, as I was growing up, everyone kept telling me that I will have a career in art. I loved drawing, I loved writing, ballet, dancing. But at the same time I never saw that as a career. I completely refused to limit myself as a filmmaker or as a writer. I [thought] I was going to be an anthropologist until I was eighteen or something.
PW: Why an anthropologist?
MLR: I think because it had to do with stories. We'd find out about stories of people in faraway lands. For me it was like a dream of traveling, which is something I really enjoy, and finding out about stories of common people. Then my brother, who is a graphic designer, was in design school. We had tons of friends that were in design school, and they were sharing classes with Image & Sound Design majors. They always told me that they saw me, could picture me, in those classes because the people there were like me. I was really furious about that, I couldn't see myself as a filmmaker. One day I decided show up for a class with my brother in college, a special class open to the community. And then I saw how people were shooting a backstage video for a fashion show and a graphic design show. And that was it, I was like, “I'm never going to be an anthropologist. I want to write, I want to tell stories. I've been watching movies all my life. I cannot really, you know, fool myself anymore.”
PW: How about surfing? When did you start surfing and why?
MLR: Well, I always loved the ocean. I went to the beach for the first time when I was three months old. I always loved swimming and just being in the water, maybe it has to do with being in contact with the water element. Then when I was probably thirteen, I went to Brazil with my brother and another of his friends, and they got two surfboards. They never actually let me touch the surfboard, but I made him promise me that the next time we travel to Brazil or some place with a surf culture, I would get a surfboard. I traveled to Brazil two years later and I got myself a board. I was completely fascinated, the idea of being outside, in the ocean, having a different perspective of the city. You always look at cities and you end up looking at this beautiful landscape with the sun setting in the ocean. And when you're surfing, you're just in the middle of the water, watching the city and how crazy everything seems.
PW: How do you feel that going to design school or art school, versus film school, informs your filmmaking style?
MLR: Well, first of all I chose design school because of the degree I was going to get. For me, living in Argentina, it feels really strange to go to film school for five years and get a degree that says you're a film director. If everything goes wrong, what am I going to do with a degree that says "I'm a film director"? So this was my idea -- let's go to image and sound design school and have a variety of things that I can relate to and work in different fields that have to do with creating images and sounds in motion. That could be screenwriting, that could be motion graphics, animation.
I think your education is completely different and your attitude toward what you're doing is completely different. You're not from day one thinking about the industry and the rules of the industry, because you're not all the time thinking about film. You're thinking about images in motion as a medium to express whatever you want to express, whatever stories you want to tell.
PW: You’re an animator and a screenwriter, and you're also a producer of documentary films. What is the relationship between animation, narrative, and documentary filmmaking for you?
MLR: It's about stories. Animation's just a medium that I really enjoy, but it's about telling stories. I was never really involved in documentary until Surfing Favela. It was not in my education, it was not interesting for me to try to portray reality until I found a good story that I wanted to tell. That's the moment when it becomes fascinating. It could be a great documentary, it could be a very boring animation. It's not about that—it's about trying to find a message that speaks to you and find something that you really feel passionate about.
PW: How did you get involved in this project?
MLR: First of all, going back to the beginning with Surfing Favela, I was actually getting ready to go to the Berlinale Talent Campus, which is a program sponsored by the Berlin Film Festival. [This is for] directors and writers and producers from all over the world, and they give them 10 days or a week of seminars with the best people in the industry. It's really a program about inspiring filmmakers to go out and do their thing. It [really improves] your self-esteem [laughs]. It was a great opportunity for me, and I got sent to a special program on the Berlinale Campus which was for screenwriters. I was writing a narrative film. There was another program for documentaries. At that moment I thought, OK, I will apply to whatever program I can because this is a great opportunity, this is like the motto of my life: Try to apply to every program. Try to accept and get any opportunity you can. Just keep on working, and something will come up.
I got accepted to the screenwriting program. I needed an idea for the documentary program. I had like three days to come up with a treatment. One of my friends, Tomás Crowder, is a surfer and national bodyboarding champion in Argentina and has been involved in surfing and extreme sports with a magazine called RAD! magazine. We'd been working together [on the] magazine writing about film. We always had an idea about making films about surfing. I just called him and said, "OK, do you have any ideas for a documentary?" He had like ten ideas for a documentary! We came up with a very complex idea of surfing in different parts of the world and surfing in different cultures—just like a really long story where we would travel all over the world from Antarctica to Malvinas, showing how people could surf in different environments and how surfing could help them achieve whatever they want to achieve in their life.
I thought it was pretty cool, so I wrote a treatment about our travel and trying to find stories about surfers. So I went to Berlin, and they chose this treatment for a pitch session with an executive of Planet TV. Out there I was pitching this crazy adventure. I was pitching and I knew it was not working, because it was just so over the top, so many locations—it was just too much. But I was really passionate about my pitch. And this man really got the idea. So we were breaking down the whole project, and one of the small ideas was about a surf school in Brazil inside a favela. That's pretty much all I knew, and that's pretty much all Tomás knew because we read a small interview about it.
PW: And who was the interview with?
MLR: It was with one of the surf schools, not Bocäo's surf school. Another surf school that is in Cantagalo. It was just a bunch of pictures of kids with trophies. It was a very small interview with this school and how surfing was helping inside a favela. It was really, really a very short paragraph—that's all we had. But it was going to be part of a really really long movie with many locations, so [at the time] it was not that important. But when I got to Berlin, I was pitching and suddenly I mentioned this story, and I realized that you know, that was it. The executive started asking about Brazil, the favela, surfing. And it was so weird, because I've been to Brazil but I had never been to Rio. I started describing the favelas like I was practically born there [laughs]. I got really carried away and I could really feel the place. He said, "Well, you should really focus on this, write a treatment, and try to apply to this contest next month." That was it. I came back to Buenos Aires, and I was really excited about it. Then we started researching and we wrote a more detailed treatment, submitted to this contest, and we made it to the top ten. But we didn't win.
So we waited and tried to find ways to produce it ourselves, Tomás and I. And then we found out about another contest, which is the Fuel Experiment, sponsored by Fuel T.V. We submitted it again, and we made it to the top 25 and then the top ten. The top ten were all winners because the channel, the network, was going to finance all those ten folks. Once we had the money to make the movie, we started talking with different people we knew in the industry. We found Natalia [Bacalini] and Maxi [Maximiliano Ezzaoui] —they are the directors of the film—that had a really intensive background in documentary, which was really, really important for a place like the favela. You cannot not hesitate a minute with your cameras inside the favela. You cannot take your time and then create shoots from setups in a place like that. It had to be people that were really skillful but practical at the same time but which were not going to be scared. What we found was a great group of people. We started working with them about the screenplay, the ideas. It was all very quick. And then probably not even two months later we were in Brazil for the first time for a week, trying to explore the situation there. When we came back, we had more or less our characters in our minds and the stories. We were confirmant (sic) that our ideas about the screenplay were real.
PW: Right.
MLR: Because when you're trying to write a screenplay for a documentary, rule number one is to be open to whatever happens in the moment. But we had a theory about how surfing was something as sacred today as it was in Polynesia years and years ago. It was a sport for leaders and kings and it had a real connection. It was like a connector to God. So our premise was to find out where and how surfing was a connection to something superior and where surfing was saving lives, and that's what we found in the favelas.
PW: [I wanted to comment on] the celebratory nature of the film, and how you integrated the music and the sound design so that, for example, the sander in the shaping room blends with the rhythm of the music. How did you decide to capture the feeling that you have when you’re in Rio in the way that [the film] was edited and sound was incorporated?
MLR: Well, I think we all agreed when we were in Rio that it's a very musical city even if there's no music playing. It's just something about the Brazilians, they way they walk, the way they talk, being by the ocean. We tried to capture different sounds there and work with the sounds of the favela and the sounds of the sea and the sounds of the [equipment] they were using in the shaping room, to create something that was more organic and natural. Also, music was a great way to relate to the kids. We would do improvisation sessions with whatever we had. Then we just had a great, creative musician like Alejandro Pereiro [laughs] and the rest is history.
PW: When you're coming from Argentina, you're coming from a different country, a different culture, and you're definitely coming from a different class background -- how do you define your role as a storyteller, being that you're telling a story about something that is not your experience?
MLR: We didn't want to have a voiceover explaining what's going on in the favela. We didn't want to explore poverty in a way many social documentaries explore it. We wanted a different approach. And I think it works out naturally because we were working with kids. First of all, we were really in tune to them as surfers.
We told them about our love for the ocean. You know, we're young and we're just trying to share an experience with them. That was how it became so natural. We just started asking questions and trying to find out about their lives and about what they wanted to do with their lives, what were their experiences. Some kids would tell us, "You know, I never been to that surfing spot," so we would try to take them to that beach. And kids are just different. They were OK that we were from Argentina and our Portuguese was not the best. They just didn't have any problem with that. It was like an adventure, you know.
It was really rewarding, because working with these kids—nobody really pays attention to them like we did during that whole month. Many people in the same city just ignore them. So the idea that this narration is so natural is because the relationship with the kids was really natural. And as we related to the kids, we started relating to their families, their friends, the adults.
PW: Right. I think that's also a universal thing with kids. When you're a kid your relationship to adults is one of them leading you, them teaching you something, and they're expecting you to follow suit. People rarely sit down with kids. Family, friends, teachers in school— rarely ask them what they want and what they think. They're usually telling them, "You're wrong and this is what's right"—
MLR: Exactly! We were there to learn from them because we wanted to be safe inside the favela, and they know how to be safe there. They knew—they could explain us which streets to take, what to do, what not to say. They were our teachers in the favela. They were sharing their knowledge in the ocean, and we were trying to give back by making a movie that they would be proud of.
PW: There's also the specter of the police in the film. The film is very much framed to show the police as the root of a lot of the violence. But it's interesting because you don't mention that in the description. The description that you have of the film talks about how there's "difficulties and opposing forces". But you never [mention it directly]. You see the people in the film talking a lot about the favelas being safe when they were growing up, a lot of the elders in the film. That people didn't have a lot of money, but that they didn't fear for their lives, whereas now they were afraid for their children and their grandchildren.
MLR: The first thing you think of when you think about going to the favela is that it's a very dangerous place. But there are many misconceptions. One is that it's very dangerous just because there are tons of drug dealers who live inside the favela. But once you go there, you realize that most of the problems are caused by how the police enter and create these daily battles. So it was something that we had to deal with, expressing that experience. And again, we didn't want to make the usual documentary, the usual social Latin American documentary about poverty and how poor people are, but they're really happy and how colorful they are, the typical Latin American cliché. We didn't want to go there. We didn't want to talk about, directly talk about, drug dealers and the police.
Our movie was about those kids, and the problems with the police were something in their daily life, and it was something really important because it had to do with their own security, but it was not the main focus of our film.
PW: Something that you said when you guys were coming up with the idea for the bigger project, which was [laughing] surfing around the world for every culture and every person -- was that surfing was a doorway to achievement. Can you talk more about that? About the experience of surfing and what that is, beyond the physical?
MLR: Well, I think any sport that connects you with nature can really become a spiritual experience. Water is something that is really powerful. It's where it all began, where you were when your mom was pregnant.
I think something we can all relate to. It's something that's, well in surfing you have really big waves, but it can be really relaxing, the idea of floating in the ocean. I think that connects you with something different. It's a community sport but it's not a team sport. You're not competing against anyone but yourself. Not even competing—you're just trying to get better at it, to flow with the elements and to align yourself with the power and the force of the ocean. It's really about concentration, because there's so many things you have to do at the same time just to catch a wave. So it's about concentration, it's about being flexible.
I don't think it's a typical sport, but at the same time, going back to the favelas, we chose surfing because we were really interested in that sport. And everyone has these fantasies about surfing, which kind of clash with the idea of poverty in the favelas. So that's how we thought it was a different idea. And there are many programs that do the same thing with soccer or Latin American football or martial arts, capoeira, drumming, many things. Finding something that makes your mind go to these lands and travel and give you some fresh air.
PW: How did you feel when you came back to Argentina? There's a period after finishing a project where you've given everything you have to something and you have to re-energize yourself. What sense of accomplishment did you have after finishing your first film?
MLR: Well, as you said, after probably like six months after we finished, we felt really stressed out. Making your first big film and shooting inside the favela and shooting with a DP who was seven months' pregnant—
PW: Oh! You never told me that [laughs].
MLR: Yeah. Everything was so complex, and it was like assembling a whole team because it was not like the directors and the producers have been working together forever. The whole thing was really stressful. But after that went away, and you start to seeing how people react to your film, and how your film is helping the people inside the favela— after you go to the theater for the first time, big screen, and you see your friends there, and they are just really excited to see your film there, it's really rewarding and makes you feel like, "OK, yes. This is what I want to feel for the rest of my life." [laughs] Yes, it just feels great that you were able to share your experience with so many people. And people are requesting Surfing Favela for these film festivals all over the world, and you're not just showing your art but you're showing other people's realities and dreams and hopes. It's just like a big circle which is not just work.
PW: At what point did you show the documentary to Bocäo and the kids, and what was their reaction?
MLR: We showed them a part of the film probably when we were about two weeks before finishing the final cut. They were really really excited. And then like two months ago, Natalia and Maxi were able to travel to Rio because they were shooting Rio because they were shooting a T.V. show called “Pasion Extrema”. They organized a screening inside the favela for not only the kids, but everyone who had been involved in Surfing Favela, and the whole community, and some other surfers and the shaper that was helping other kids in different favelas to go there and share the screening. It was awesome, because it was a dream for the kids in that they were on the big screen, they were actors, they could [see] their names [in the credits]. They could see themselves surfing—that was really striking for them. Because you never know how good you are until you see yourself on the big screen and specifically inside the water. They were really, really thrilled.
You could see all the changes in their emotions, the [effect of the] ocean in their lives. That was really amazing, how a little bit of help with their self-esteem did miracles. Because some of the kids, when we met them, they were surfing, they were just starting out. They were loving it, but they were not really good at it. And we created small stars out of them. They started practicing more and more, and now they're winning small contests. Some of them are getting small sponsors. It's great! And even with kids that were chosen not because they're great surfers but because they look really great on camera or because they were really well spoken. In less than a year they were making really great changes. That's the best thing for me.
PW: About your audience: who did you envision the audience for the film being, and once it was finished was that audience still the same?
MLR: Um, this is a very personal answer. But at first we thought we thought were targeting the film to all surfers around the world. Like surf videos, we're trans-targeting the surf media, with an edge. But after several screenings of Surfing Favela, I think our audience is way bigger. We have lots of people really interested in documentary, social documentaries, and they had no clue about surfing. They just fall in love with the story. It's a paradox because some surfers—I'm saying something general, but for some surfers that are really addicted to watching these very silly surf videos with this very silly—I mean, it's just a guy surfing in very repetitive movements and repetitive sound -- Surfing Favela is a very complicated experience for them. So sometimes we are screening and you find a group of young surfers, and you start to see how they cannot really remain quiet in their seats because it's just not a typical surf movie. You have to read subtitles; you have to face yourself with the social reality. And we have good shots of surfing, but let's face it—these are not pro surfers, so it’s more about the love for surfing. So I think there's difference in what we thought our audience was going to be. Of course, for more grownup surfers the movie is really emotional. But for teenagers and the typical teenage kid who is really into surfing and freeboarding, it doesn't work that well. But we're happy because we're getting a bigger audience.
PW: What will your next project be?
MLR: Money will decide what my next project is. I'm pitching different things. I have a narrative I want to direct. I've been trying to produce an animation series, and I'm trying also to sell a series on extreme sports, TV shows similar to Surfing Favela. There's just many things going on, many ideas. Hopefully I will find the right person to produce my next feature and the right team to continue working with any of these projects. There's really a lot of things going on, and I'm open to what the universe decides which one is gonna be the next one.
PW: How can people see the film?
MLR: Right now you can check out Surfing Favela in different film festivals around the world. That's going to be happening for at least another six months. Fuel TV has the rights to distribute Surfing Favela, and we're hoping they'll release the DVD soon. It's also airing on Nat Geo in different locations. During September you can watch on NAT GEO Latin America.
PW: So, what do you want, personally, for your mark to be?
MLR: I really want to keep on writing, and I really want to direct. I'm not sure if I'm ready yet, but that's just me—I never feel I'm ready, now or a year later [laughs]. You jump into the water, and that will be it – either you're ready or you're drowning. I really want to direct narrative films that create different realities—sort of the opposite of documentaries. I want to create worlds from scratch. Like filmmakers I really admire like Tim Burton or Julio Medem, that are really able to tell stories in different landscapes, different environments. But still all those stories are really human and really real, but the universes they create are awesome. So that's my goal. Maybe I will do that through animation. Or not. It's just about the story.
PW: My last question to you is a question that is posed in Surfing Favela by ‘22’, which is: What is surfing to you?
MLR: It's a dream. It's like the perfect dream-state. It's the place I go when I close my eyes and dream of my own special paradise for five minutes during the day. That's the state of mind of surfing. It's my place and my time to dream.
María Laura is now working on directing her first feature film, Arcos, while she writes and produces several other shorts. She currently directs Seiren Films, a company devoted to content design for film, T.V., and animation. She can be found at http://www.seirenfilms.com
